“… the mature Catholic who wants a deeper, less anthropomorphized and more rooted liturgical experience … goes to the never-abrogated Gregorian rite.”

It’s strange: my conception of the “mature Catholic” centers around the image of the Blessed Mother kneeling before the one and only Sacrifice of the Mass as it was offered for, and in the midst of, the most abusive and irreverent people we can imagine. Wasn’t it the immature Catholics who chose to absent themselves from that Mass at Calvary because they couldn’t bear to see the suffering that Christ chose to endure for our salvation, even for those who abused Him?

It seems to me what you want to give is a encomium of the NO, or, in NO terms, you want to have a “celebration” of the goodness of the NO. There are hints, however, that what you actually want to make is a case for the superiority of the NO, which of course will cause impassioned response.

So if you want to give an encomium of the NO, then make it. No one can reasonably fault you for saying nice things about mass when your express purpose is only to say nice things about mass. If you want to make a case for the superiority of the NO (which is what you were doing in the comments of your last post) then lay out your case, but don’t call it a “defense”- you are in fact on offense.

As Martin Mosebach wisely notes in his impressive work, The Heresy of Formlessness, the fact that reverence is “optional” in the new Mass is precisely one of the greatest arguments against it.

You’d also do well not to paint traditionally-minded Catholics with too broad a brush here. The suspicions of Masonic plots, the noteworthyness of Paul VI’s own admission that the new Mass was intended to be more comfortable an experience for Protestants, etc., all have substantive grounding in fact behind them. Whether they have been exaggerated by some in the “traditionalist” camp is open to debate, but the questions themselves are not imaginary or made from whole cloth.

I’ve seen the arguments by both sides, and from an intellectual and theological standpoint I’d argue that the argument that the traditional liturgy of the Church is a more reverent experience that is more psychologically oriented toward God and has a track record of success in nurturing saints is undeniable. The polemics used by many in the traditionalist camp leave much to be desired, but the merits of their positions are hard to dispute.

One liturgy was formed over centuries, shaped by saints, and infused with the mind of the Church. The other was formed by a committee, designed with ecumenical rather than pedagogical purposes in mind, and has coincided with the greatest decline in the Catholic Faith that has perhaps ever occurred in the history of our religion.

I struggle to understand how anyone who is intellectually honest can continue to have discussions that equate the two liturgies. We may be, for pastoral reasons, stuck with the Novus Ordo for the foreseeable future, but the mature Catholic who wants a deeper, less anthropomorphized and more rooted liturgical experience (that also shares much more in common with all other approved rites of the Church) goes to the never-abrogated Gregorian rite.

If it were simply a matter of taste, the point would be moot, and both Masses would be fine. But as Catholics, we have always believed in a hierarchy of goods, and in the principles of objective truth and beauty. With those standards applied, I struggle to understand why this continues to be a debate.

Instead, it is a wonderful opportunity to pray and offer sacrifices (like the sacrifice of enduring the loopiness) for those who are abusing or denigrating the liturgy.

By the help of God’s grace, that is what enables me to persevere.

I think if they did, there would not be so much work put into bending and breaking rules or arguing about the rules.

I have seen the occasional, beautiful NO Mass, and I revel in those memories, because they are so few.

As something of a liturgy zealot (at least I’ve been referred to as such in these parts) it took me a long time to get the calm I needed to be effective…and charitable.

I applaud the Pope for putting such work into trying to stem the tide of loopiness.

Lord, just how patient are we expected to be??