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	<title>Comments on: To be deep in history is to cease to be angry</title>
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	<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/</link>
	<description>Musings about the Catholic Faith</description>
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		<title>By: Better than bitter &#171; Divine Life &#8211; A Blog by Eric Sammons</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-9792</link>
		<dc:creator>Better than bitter &#171; Divine Life &#8211; A Blog by Eric Sammons</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Apr 2010 12:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-9792</guid>
		<description>[...] Bitter — Even in the Face of Scandal. In it, I apply the principles I outlined in my blog post To be deep in history is to cease to be angry to the current scandals facing the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Bitter — Even in the Face of Scandal. In it, I apply the principles I outlined in my blog post To be deep in history is to cease to be angry to the current scandals facing the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: FrDarryl</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-6654</link>
		<dc:creator>FrDarryl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jan 2010 19:17:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-6654</guid>
		<description>Fantastic thoughts and love the connection between anger and fear. I&#039;ve noticed the same phenomenon in England:

http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/features/columnists/4840091.Time_to_take_a_cue_from_the_weather____chill_out_/?ref=eb</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic thoughts and love the connection between anger and fear. I&#8217;ve noticed the same phenomenon in England:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/features/columnists/4840091.Time_to_take_a_cue_from_the_weather____chill_out_/?ref=eb" rel="nofollow">http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/features/columnists/4840091.Time_to_take_a_cue_from_the_weather____chill_out_/?ref=eb</a></p>
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		<title>By: Giovanni</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-3148</link>
		<dc:creator>Giovanni</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Oct 2009 21:46:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3148</guid>
		<description>All the things you have mentioned are things that should make all Catholics rejoice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All the things you have mentioned are things that should make all Catholics rejoice.</p>
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		<title>By: The Cellarer</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-3123</link>
		<dc:creator>The Cellarer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Oct 2009 22:47:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3123</guid>
		<description>Maybe this is an example of a good attitude...

Green shoots
from Saint Mary Magdalen by Fr Ray Blake

I see so many good things happening in the Church in this country today major things like:


The Pope&#039;s visit to the UK

Beatification of John Henry Cardinal Newman

Visit of the Relics of St Therese

The new English translation of the Missal

Announcement of Bishop Longley&#039;s move to Birmingham

Ordination of Bishop Moth as Bishop for the Forces

Archbishop Vincent Nichols&#039; appointment to Westminster



Then there are little things, like the quality of so many of those who have been ordained recently, the type of young man that is going to the seminary nowadays, as well as the teaching staff of our seminaries.

There is the growing enthusiasm for prayer, the rise in Eucharistic Devotion, in a more deeply prayerful liturgy, the interest in prayers like the Rosary. There are other things like the way the boys at Westminster Cathedral have started receiving Holy Communion, kneeling and on the tongue and the return to the use of the High Altar there. The increase in the celebration of the TLM, which signifies the hermeneutic of continuity.
Another little thing, the Bishop&#039;s Conference have just published online, Jubilate Deo the basic chant of the Church it is just a little thing but it wouldn&#039;t have happened a couple of years ago.
Then there are the rumours of a new motu proprio coming shortly which deepen a more prayerful liturgy and a stronger Catholic identity.

I know it is easy to &quot;rain on the parade&quot; and to find negative things or to criticise but I would interested to hear of what you consider to be positive, good things, happening in the Church today.

http://marymagdalen.blogspot.com/2009/10/green-shoots.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe this is an example of a good attitude&#8230;</p>
<p>Green shoots<br />
from Saint Mary Magdalen by Fr Ray Blake</p>
<p>I see so many good things happening in the Church in this country today major things like:</p>
<p>The Pope&#8217;s visit to the UK</p>
<p>Beatification of John Henry Cardinal Newman</p>
<p>Visit of the Relics of St Therese</p>
<p>The new English translation of the Missal</p>
<p>Announcement of Bishop Longley&#8217;s move to Birmingham</p>
<p>Ordination of Bishop Moth as Bishop for the Forces</p>
<p>Archbishop Vincent Nichols&#8217; appointment to Westminster</p>
<p>Then there are little things, like the quality of so many of those who have been ordained recently, the type of young man that is going to the seminary nowadays, as well as the teaching staff of our seminaries.</p>
<p>There is the growing enthusiasm for prayer, the rise in Eucharistic Devotion, in a more deeply prayerful liturgy, the interest in prayers like the Rosary. There are other things like the way the boys at Westminster Cathedral have started receiving Holy Communion, kneeling and on the tongue and the return to the use of the High Altar there. The increase in the celebration of the TLM, which signifies the hermeneutic of continuity.<br />
Another little thing, the Bishop&#8217;s Conference have just published online, Jubilate Deo the basic chant of the Church it is just a little thing but it wouldn&#8217;t have happened a couple of years ago.<br />
Then there are the rumours of a new motu proprio coming shortly which deepen a more prayerful liturgy and a stronger Catholic identity.</p>
<p>I know it is easy to &#8220;rain on the parade&#8221; and to find negative things or to criticise but I would interested to hear of what you consider to be positive, good things, happening in the Church today.</p>
<p><a href="http://marymagdalen.blogspot.com/2009/10/green-shoots.html" rel="nofollow">http://marymagdalen.blogspot.com/2009/10/green-shoots.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: gretchen</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-3111</link>
		<dc:creator>gretchen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Oct 2009 14:09:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3111</guid>
		<description>Wow, Eric, 54 comments!  I didn&#039;t know that many people read your blog. : )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, Eric, 54 comments!  I didn&#8217;t know that many people read your blog. : )</p>
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		<title>By: Giovanni</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-3085</link>
		<dc:creator>Giovanni</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:00:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3085</guid>
		<description>Paul Dion:

VII as I have stated before is not the problem. It is what happened and what was done in the name of the council that was and is the problem. 

I was directly answering one of his assertions, that the anger stems from fear. And one of his questions, as to why is all this discussion about Liturgy so prevalent?

Also I do not dispute that things may have been bad with many Priests not taking their vocation seriously and giving bad Liturgies however let us not forget that back then there was always a continuous renewal as far as Priests were concerned as there was no shortage of vocations. Now you have bad or heterodox Priests but you are stuck with them for lack of replacements.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul Dion:</p>
<p>VII as I have stated before is not the problem. It is what happened and what was done in the name of the council that was and is the problem. </p>
<p>I was directly answering one of his assertions, that the anger stems from fear. And one of his questions, as to why is all this discussion about Liturgy so prevalent?</p>
<p>Also I do not dispute that things may have been bad with many Priests not taking their vocation seriously and giving bad Liturgies however let us not forget that back then there was always a continuous renewal as far as Priests were concerned as there was no shortage of vocations. Now you have bad or heterodox Priests but you are stuck with them for lack of replacements.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Dion</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-2/#comment-3080</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Dion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Oct 2009 03:29:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3080</guid>
		<description>Giovanni:
Where did you pick up that Mr. Sammons fails to see the importance of liturgy?  I don&#039;t know how old you are, but I am old enough to re,member sloppy,sloppier, sloppiest liturgies before &quot;VII&quot;, as you call it.  &quot;VII&quot; took its direction from history, not from nostalgia, but from solid Tradition.  This article is spot-on.  Good job, Eric.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Giovanni:<br />
Where did you pick up that Mr. Sammons fails to see the importance of liturgy?  I don&#8217;t know how old you are, but I am old enough to re,member sloppy,sloppier, sloppiest liturgies before &#8220;VII&#8221;, as you call it.  &#8220;VII&#8221; took its direction from history, not from nostalgia, but from solid Tradition.  This article is spot-on.  Good job, Eric.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-3077</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Oct 2009 01:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3077</guid>
		<description>Eric, 
I think that you really hit the nail on the head with this article.  Looking back at history and seeing all that we have survived really should be a comfort to all Catholics.  It&#039;s soothing to know that the problems of this age, too, can be overcome.  Looking at the evils of today is enough to make a person angry and disgusted.  However, the proper perspective can go along way to turning that righteous anger into calm resoluteness that will drive a person to make real progress in an evenhanded way.  Yelling and namecalling just isn&#039;t very effective at getting results, I think we can all be agreed.  
It&#039;s a very reasonable thing to work for liturgical reform.  It&#039;s very reasonable thing to work for more traditional or reverent worship.  It&#039;s a very reasonable opinion that communion on the tongue is more reverent than on the hand.  However, anger and argumentation leads one to make the jump from &quot;we should discuss moving back to communion on the tongue&quot; to &quot;all Catholics who take communion on the hand are inferior, and all priests who celebrate the ordinary force of the mass are Godless perverts&quot;.  See how anger can lead from reasonable to unreasonable?  Fruitful dialogue to useless ranting?   Humble service to the Church, to spiritual pride?  

Another thing history will show is that orthodoxy so often resides in between two heresies, one reacting to the other.  Arianism reacted to Sabellianism, Monophysitism to Nestorianism.  And today, we have sedevacantist types reacting to modernism so violently that they put themselves out of the church in the other direction.  The lesson here is when we work to repair liturgical abuses or whatever God calls us to do, do it with humility and prudence (the charioteer of all virtues).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric,<br />
I think that you really hit the nail on the head with this article.  Looking back at history and seeing all that we have survived really should be a comfort to all Catholics.  It&#8217;s soothing to know that the problems of this age, too, can be overcome.  Looking at the evils of today is enough to make a person angry and disgusted.  However, the proper perspective can go along way to turning that righteous anger into calm resoluteness that will drive a person to make real progress in an evenhanded way.  Yelling and namecalling just isn&#8217;t very effective at getting results, I think we can all be agreed.<br />
It&#8217;s a very reasonable thing to work for liturgical reform.  It&#8217;s very reasonable thing to work for more traditional or reverent worship.  It&#8217;s a very reasonable opinion that communion on the tongue is more reverent than on the hand.  However, anger and argumentation leads one to make the jump from &#8220;we should discuss moving back to communion on the tongue&#8221; to &#8220;all Catholics who take communion on the hand are inferior, and all priests who celebrate the ordinary force of the mass are Godless perverts&#8221;.  See how anger can lead from reasonable to unreasonable?  Fruitful dialogue to useless ranting?   Humble service to the Church, to spiritual pride?  </p>
<p>Another thing history will show is that orthodoxy so often resides in between two heresies, one reacting to the other.  Arianism reacted to Sabellianism, Monophysitism to Nestorianism.  And today, we have sedevacantist types reacting to modernism so violently that they put themselves out of the church in the other direction.  The lesson here is when we work to repair liturgical abuses or whatever God calls us to do, do it with humility and prudence (the charioteer of all virtues).</p>
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		<title>By: Giovanni</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-3074</link>
		<dc:creator>Giovanni</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Oct 2009 22:35:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3074</guid>
		<description>Mr. Sammons that is the crux of the matter. The fact that you can not see the importance of the Liturgy is what is so worrying. This is a clear effect of the &quot;spirit of VII.&quot;

The Second Vatican Council simply re-stated that which the Church holds true. However those that are moved by the so called &quot;spirit&quot; saw it as an opportunity to change the Church. Others as a call to make it more Protestant friendly, now weather there intentions were good or bad is not important for only God knows their hearts. However the damage that was made in many cases ended in rupture from Tradition, confusion in Church teaching and even out right heretical thought. 

There are parts of VII that need to be clarified so abuses can stop. Bishops act too softly in many of these issues and in the extreme Bishops tend to be part of the problem. It is almost like a cult of niceness is charge of the Church.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Sammons that is the crux of the matter. The fact that you can not see the importance of the Liturgy is what is so worrying. This is a clear effect of the &#8220;spirit of VII.&#8221;</p>
<p>The Second Vatican Council simply re-stated that which the Church holds true. However those that are moved by the so called &#8220;spirit&#8221; saw it as an opportunity to change the Church. Others as a call to make it more Protestant friendly, now weather there intentions were good or bad is not important for only God knows their hearts. However the damage that was made in many cases ended in rupture from Tradition, confusion in Church teaching and even out right heretical thought. </p>
<p>There are parts of VII that need to be clarified so abuses can stop. Bishops act too softly in many of these issues and in the extreme Bishops tend to be part of the problem. It is almost like a cult of niceness is charge of the Church.</p>
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		<title>By: Rellis</title>
		<link>http://ericsammons.com/blog/2009/10/09/to-be-deep-in-history-is-to-cease-to-be-angry/comment-page-1/#comment-3073</link>
		<dc:creator>Rellis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Oct 2009 20:32:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ericsammons.com/blog/?p=4390#comment-3073</guid>
		<description>The reason, Eric Sammons, why most posts (including mine) impute liturgy in your post is because you slam Catholic bloggers on the right.

Most conservative Catholic bloggers are liturgy-first bloggers.

Ergo, you&#039;re slamming liturgical traditionalists (i.e., conservative Catholic bloggers) as &quot;angry.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reason, Eric Sammons, why most posts (including mine) impute liturgy in your post is because you slam Catholic bloggers on the right.</p>
<p>Most conservative Catholic bloggers are liturgy-first bloggers.</p>
<p>Ergo, you&#8217;re slamming liturgical traditionalists (i.e., conservative Catholic bloggers) as &#8220;angry.&#8221;</p>
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